Melty Blood/MBAACC/Neco & Mech/Crescent Moon: Difference between revisions
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|cancel=-SE-, -N-, -SP-, -EX-, (J) | |cancel=-SE-, -N-, -SP-, -EX-, (J) | ||
|guard=LH | |guard=LH | ||
|startup= | |startup=5 | ||
|active=4 | |active=4 | ||
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|cancel=N, SP, EX, (J) | |cancel=N, SP, EX, (J) | ||
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|active=3 | |active=3 | ||
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|cancel=N, SP, EX, (J) | |cancel=N, SP, EX, (J) | ||
|guard=LH | |guard=LH | ||
|startup= | |startup=12 | ||
|active={{Tooltip | text=8| hovertext=2, 4, 2}} | |active={{Tooltip | text=8| hovertext=2, 4, 2}} | ||
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|cancel=N, SP, EX, (J) | |cancel=N, SP, EX, (J) | ||
|guard=LH | |guard=LH | ||
|startup= | |startup=15 | ||
|active={{Tooltip | text=18| hovertext=12, 4, 2}} | |active={{Tooltip | text=18| hovertext=12, 4, 2}} | ||
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|cancel=-SE-, -N-, -SP-, -EX-, (J) | |cancel=-SE-, -N-, -SP-, -EX-, (J) | ||
|guard=LH | |guard=LH | ||
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|active=4 | |active=4 | ||
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|cancel=N, SP, EX, (J) | |cancel=N, SP, EX, (J) | ||
|guard=L | |guard=L | ||
|startup= | |startup=8 | ||
|active={{Tooltip | text=6| hovertext=4, 2}} | |active={{Tooltip | text=6| hovertext=4, 2}} | ||
|recovery=19 | |recovery=19 | ||
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|cancel=N, SP, EX, (J) | |cancel=N, SP, EX, (J) | ||
|guard=L | |guard=L | ||
|startup= | |startup=13 | ||
|active=3 | |active=3 | ||
|recovery=28 | |recovery=28 | ||
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|cancel=SE, N, J | |cancel=SE, N, J | ||
|guard=LHA | |guard=LHA | ||
|startup= | |startup=7 | ||
|active=4 | |active=4 | ||
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|cancel=N, J | |cancel=N, J | ||
|guard=HA | |guard=HA | ||
|startup= | |startup=6 | ||
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|cancel=N, J | |cancel=N, J | ||
|guard=HA | |guard=HA | ||
|startup= | |startup=11 | ||
|active=7 | |active=7 | ||
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|cancel=N, J | |cancel=N, J | ||
|guard=HA | |guard=HA | ||
|startup= | |startup=27 | ||
|active=8 | |active=8 | ||
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|cancel=SP, EX, (J) | |cancel=SP, EX, (J) | ||
|guard=LHA | |guard=LHA | ||
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|active=4 | |active=4 | ||
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|cancel=SP, EX, (J) | |cancel=SP, EX, (J) | ||
|guard=LH | |guard=LH | ||
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|active=4 | |active=4 | ||
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|cancel= | |cancel= | ||
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|cancel=(Any if Raw) | |cancel=(Any if Raw) | ||
|guard=U | |guard=U | ||
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|recovery={{Tooltip | text=12| hovertext=Landing recovery.}} | |recovery={{Tooltip | text=12| hovertext=Landing recovery.}} | ||
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|cancel= | |cancel= | ||
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|cancel= | |cancel= | ||
|guard=LHA | |guard=LHA | ||
|startup= | |startup=8 | ||
|active=4 | |active=4 | ||
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|guard=U | |guard=U | ||
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|active=4 | |active=4 | ||
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|cancel= | |cancel= | ||
|guard=U | |guard=U | ||
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|active=10 | |active=10 | ||
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|cancel= | |cancel= | ||
|guard=U | |guard=U | ||
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|active=10 | |active=10 | ||
|recovery={{Tooltip | text=15| hovertext=Landing recovery.}} | |recovery={{Tooltip | text=15| hovertext=Landing recovery.}} | ||
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|cancel= | |cancel= | ||
|guard=LHA | |guard=LHA | ||
|startup= | |startup=51 | ||
|active={{Tooltip | text=16| hovertext=8 hits. 2 x8}} | |active={{Tooltip | text=16| hovertext=8 hits. 2 x8}} | ||
|recovery={{Tooltip | text=48| hovertext=Mech-Hisui animation duration.}} | |recovery={{Tooltip | text=48| hovertext=Mech-Hisui animation duration.}} | ||
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|active={{Tooltip | text=14| hovertext=7 hits. 2 x7}} | |active={{Tooltip | text=14| hovertext=7 hits. 2 x7}} | ||
|recovery={{Tooltip | text=38| hovertext=Mech-Hisui animation duration.}} | |recovery={{Tooltip | text=38| hovertext=Mech-Hisui animation duration.}} | ||
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|cancel= | |cancel= | ||
|guard=HA<br>(Whiffs vs. Crouch) | |guard=HA<br>(Whiffs vs. Crouch) | ||
|startup=1+ | |startup=1+25 | ||
|active={{Tooltip | text=16| hovertext=8 hits. (1, 3) x4}} | |active={{Tooltip | text=16| hovertext=8 hits. (1, 3) x4}} | ||
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|guard=LHA | |guard=LHA | ||
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|active={{Tooltip | text=13| hovertext=5 hits. 3, 3, 3, 3, 1 }} | |active={{Tooltip | text=13| hovertext=5 hits. 3, 3, 3, 3, 1 }} | ||
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|guard=LHA | |guard=LHA | ||
|startup= | |startup=25 | ||
|active={{Tooltip | text=27| hovertext=15 hits. (1, 2) x7, 6}} | |active={{Tooltip | text=27| hovertext=15 hits. (1, 2) x7, 6}} | ||
|recovery=12 | |recovery=12 | ||
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|cancel= | |cancel= | ||
|guard=LHA | |guard=LHA | ||
|startup=1+ | |startup=1+7 | ||
|active={{Tooltip | text=28| hovertext=19 hits. 1 x18, 10}} | |active={{Tooltip | text=28| hovertext=19 hits. 1 x18, 10}} | ||
|recovery=14 | |recovery=14 | ||
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|cancel= | |cancel= | ||
|guard=LHA | |guard=LHA | ||
|startup= | |startup=26 | ||
|active={{Tooltip | text=X| hovertext=40f total active frame duration.
8 hits. 5 x8}} | |active={{Tooltip | text=X| hovertext=40f total active frame duration.
8 hits. 5 x8}} | ||
|recovery=9 | |recovery=9 | ||
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|guard=LHA | |guard=LHA | ||
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|active={{Tooltip | text=X| hovertext=50f total active frame duration.
10 hits. 5 x10}} | |active={{Tooltip | text=X| hovertext=50f total active frame duration.
10 hits. 5 x10}} | ||
|recovery=24 | |recovery=24 | ||
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|cancel= | |cancel= | ||
|guard=LHA | |guard=LHA | ||
|startup=13+ | |startup=13+3 | ||
|active={{Tooltip | text=X| hovertext=86f total active frame duration.
17 hits. 3 (3) 5 x16}} | |active={{Tooltip | text=X| hovertext=86f total active frame duration.
17 hits. 3 (3) 5 x16}} | ||
|recovery=23 | |recovery=23 | ||
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|cancel= | |cancel= | ||
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|active=9 | |active=9 | ||
|recovery=27 | |recovery=27 | ||
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|cancel= | |cancel= | ||
|guard=LHA | |guard=LHA | ||
|startup= | |startup=19 | ||
|active={{Tooltip | text=20| hovertext=7 Hits max.}} | |active={{Tooltip | text=20| hovertext=7 Hits max.}} | ||
|recovery=28 | |recovery=28 | ||
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|cancel= | |cancel= | ||
|guard=LHA | |guard=LHA | ||
|startup=5+ | |startup=5+10 | ||
|active={{Tooltip | text=20| hovertext=11 Hits max.}} | |active={{Tooltip | text=20| hovertext=11 Hits max.}} | ||
|recovery=27 | |recovery=27 | ||
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|cancel= | |cancel= | ||
|guard=LHA | |guard=LHA | ||
|startup=17+ | |startup=17+8 | ||
|active={{Tooltip | text=X| hovertext=Hitboxes are active until it leaves the screen. 78~83 frames maximum.}} | |active={{Tooltip | text=X| hovertext=Hitboxes are active until it leaves the screen. 78~83 frames maximum.}} | ||
|recovery=21 | |recovery=21 | ||
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|cancel= | |cancel= | ||
|guard=LHA | |guard=LHA | ||
|startup=1+ | |startup=1+23 | ||
|active={{Tooltip | text=X| hovertext=Hitboxes are active until it leaves the screen. 83~88 frames maximum.}} | |active={{Tooltip | text=X| hovertext=Hitboxes are active until it leaves the screen. 83~88 frames maximum.}} | ||
|recovery=22 | |recovery=22 | ||
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|cancel= | |cancel= | ||
|guard=U | |guard=U | ||
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|active=13 (23) 13 (21) 13 (23) 13 | |active=13 (23) 13 (21) 13 (23) 13 | ||
|recovery=111 | |recovery=111 |
Revision as of 04:02, 19 July 2022
Character Page Progress
This page is still a work in progress, consider joining as an editor to help expand it. Please update this character's roadmap page when one of the editing goals have been reached.
In Progress | To-do |
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Additional Resources
C-NecoMech Match Video Database
Players to watch/ask
JP:
- javashige (Java磁)
- Text goes here after asterisk
NA:
- Text goes here after asterisk
- Text goes here after asterisk
Overview
Strengths |
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Weaknesses |
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C-NecoMech is a setplay oriented character with strong oki and pressure tools, although she has a fairly low damage ceiling without a counter hit starter. 214X resets is what her pressure is all about, ambiguously using it in blockstrings to keep your opponent guessing if they should jump out or not during the resets, many of which are not easy to pin point the exact points where they can jump out, along side a number of frametraps and throw/low mixups. If you can force respect you can guard break your opponent very fast with her pressure, however her pressure can be accidentally ended if you're not careful and hit neco during it, as you can not use any Neco summons when Neco is knocked down.
She also has one of the best forward air dashes in the game and is a considerably fast character. She has the fastest walk speed in the game, but her back walk speed, back dash, and air back dash are considerably slower than average. She does not have the best neutral with her normals, but you will mostly be controlling space with the threat of the air unblockable Neco, which can be activated with either 623X, 6C, 6[C], or j.[C], however you can be counterhit during it if you are not careful. The best way to use the AUB Neco is from a safe position (when the opponent is knocked down or a distance away) or to punish something the opponent does from across the screen if they are not ready for it. You can hit Neco during scrambles to force favorable trades if you're feeling brave, but it's high risk medium reward at best. She also has some of the better anti air options in the game with her 5A, 22A(has clash frames and is top body invul on startup), 5C/[C], and 6C/[C](usually hitting Neco at the same time for the AUB since 6C is not AUB).
General Gameplan
Neutral
- Spacing the Neco
Many players trying to play C-NecoMech often are unsure of how to keep Neco positioned properly in neutral to fully take advantage of her. Realistically, the easiest way for one to understand how to position Neco is through experience alone. However, there are a number of things to keep in mind to expedite the process of learning how to manage her positioning. Firstly, you must recognize Neco as an extension of your normals/specials and not just a disjointed hitbox. Neco can be activated with 623x, 6C, 6[C], or j.[C], and each of these have a unique use for various scenarios (detailed further in Defense and anti air options). Secondly, you are to let the opponent come to the Neco's current position in an opportunistic way. Think of Neco as an occasional anchor to base your movements and neutral decisions around.
- Setting up expectations
With that being said, if you base all your neutral decisions around Neco, you will start to become predictable. It is very easy to get counter hit in trying to hit Neco with a j.[C] for example, as it has a very long start and your path towards the Neco can be very predictable. However that doesn't mean you shouldn't ever try to hit Neco, you just have to condition your opponent into expecting Neco. For example, moving in a way that makes the opponent think you are going to hit Neco with a j.[C] so they preemptively move to counter hit your start up. But instead of you doing j.[C], you do a normal j.C(or j.A/B) and you counter hit their attempt to hit you. Another example is doing an empty neutral jump above the Neco, and then suddenly airdashing forward or landing to hit Neco with 6C, or double jumping to then hit the Neco, etc. The key thing to note is to make your opponent expect certain things regarding Neco and then mix up your options around it. With the implicit threat of Neco being established it allows you to control a portion of the screen without needing to do anything (Of course, be sure to actually hit Neco from time to time to remind them it exists).
- Learning to not depend on Neco
It is also important to know how to play neutral with her normals alone, as Neco will not always be in the right position. As a general rule (this also applies to any character you play) you shouldn't use up all your movement options right away. Don't double jump in the air and then airdash to meet your opponent who's a full screen away. It is very tempting to just air dash at your opponent all the time, as her airdash carries you very far. Focus on approaching with dashing(her dash allows her to hold [1] during, which is useful against certain zoners), walking, neutral jumping and drifting forward to see what your opponent will do, basically not doing anything committal unless you have a clear line to approach.
Pressure
Refer to the following video: (Youtube)
- Note: Every time you hit neco with j.[C] and it flies directly above the opponent, you can do either do 2B(beats fuzzy jumping/attempting to jump, since 2B hits two times), walk/dash up throw either early or late(beats throw OS), Dash up IAD(beats opponent using 4E to throw), dashing up then neutral super jump j.[C] as the neco hits(beats heat and throw OS), and simply crouching and waiting from where you landed(beats heat and DP)
Catching jump outs on wake up: (Streamable)
- Mixups, setplay, and gimmicks
Refer to the following video: (Youtube)
j.C fuzzy on tall characters: (Streamable)
- Note: You can also do 2C 5A(whiff) for the j.[C] set ups after 623C knockdown.
Defense/Anti-Air options
- Defense
In addition to heat, ex shield, and bunker, Neco Mech also has access to 22x. 22A is top body invul on start up with clash frames and is best used in conjunction with shield, very powerful against moves like h len j.2C or nero j.B. 22B is not invul on start up, but is fully invul shortly after with a clash frame. Whatever you do, do NOT use 22B to contest jump ins. 22B does not have as fast of a start up as 22A, so what often happens with 22B is that you clash their jump in, and they are able to block once they land. 22B is unsafe on block, and should be used as a reversal to resets in pressure(dash ins) or when the opponent can't get a proper meaty. 22C is fully invul on start up, but has no clash frame. It doesn't have a very fast start up(comes out frame 13), but it is a reversal nonetheless.
- Anti air
Neco Mech has access to some fairly decent anti air options with her 5A, 5C/[C], 6C/[C], 623A and j.[C]. 5A is a self explanatory anti air, best used in conjunction with ex shield. 5C/[C] is bit more of a niche anti air option as it does have a good hitbox disjoint above Neco Mech, but its slow start up, long recovery, and momentum from being charged makes it awkward to use solely as an anti air. The most realistic application of 5[C] as an anti air is dashing under someone in the air, and using it to charge towards their position. 6C/[C] is your best anti air option overall, as the ability to trade with this move is phenomenal. It covers a large area in front and above Neco Mech, and as long as you aren't late to use it, it trades very often or even outright beats many air normals. When used in conjuction with hitting neco, it allows you to anti air various kinds of approaches. Note that 6C is not AUB, but 6[C] is AUB. 6[C] is useful for catching predictable landing trajectories, such as a neutral air tech near the corner. 6C/[C] also allows you to target enemies who cross over you in the air, as hitting neco when the enemy is behind you enables neco's trajectory to auto correct and fly towards their current position. 623A has many of the same applications as 6C when it comes to hitting neco, but the main feature of 623A over 6C is that it has less recovery, and is +0 on block. 623A by itself is not a great anti air however. j.[C] being used to hit neco is a very strong as a preemptive anti air zoning tool, but converting into a combo isn't possible more often than not since the opponent can often air tech out before you get close enough for a confirm. It is very easy to confirm on counter hit however.
Combos
Combo Notation Help | |
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Disclaimer: Combos are written by various writers, so the actual notation used in pages can differ from the standard one. | |
X > Y | X input is cancelled into Y. |
X > delay Y | Must wait for a short period before cancelling X input into Y. |
X, Y | X input is linked into Y, meaning Y is done after X's recovery period. |
X+Y | Buttons X and Y must be input simultaneously. |
X/Y | Either the X or Y input can be used. |
X~Y | This notation has two meanings.
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X(w) | X input must not hit the opponent (Whiff). |
j.X | X input is done in the air, implies a jump/jump cancel if the previous move was done from the ground. Applies to all air chain sections:
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sj.X | X input is done after a super jump. Notated as sj8.X and sj9.X for neutral and forward super jumps respectively. |
dj.X | X input is done after a double jump. |
sdj.X | X input is done after a double super jump. |
tk.X | Stands for Tiger Knee. X motion must be buffered before jumping, inputting the move as close to the ground as possible. (ex. tk.236A) |
(X) | X is optional. Typically the combo will be easier if omitted. |
[X] | Input X is held down. Also referred to as Blowback Edge (BE). Depending on the character, this can indicate that this button is held down and not released until indicated by the release notation. |
]X[ | Input X is released. Will only appear if a button is previously held down. This type of input is referred to as Negative Edge. |
{X} | Button X should only be held down briefly to get a partially charged version instead of the fully charged one. |
X(N) | Attack "X" should only hit N times. |
(XYZ)xN | XYZ string must be performed N times. Combos using this notation are usually referred to as loops. |
(XYZ^) | A pre-existing combo labelled XYZ is inserted here for shortening purposes. |
CH | The first attack must be a Counter Hit. |
Air CH | The first attack must be a Counter Hit on an airborne opponent. |
66 | Performs a ground forward dash. |
j.66 | Performs an aerial forward dash, used as a cancel for certain characters' air strings. |
IAD/IABD | Performs an Instant AirDash. |
AT | Performs an Air Throw. (j.6/4A+D) |
IH | Performs an Initiative Heat. |
AD | Performs an Arc Drive. |
AAD | Performs an Another Arc Drive. |
Alternatively, here's a video javashige has on C-NecoMech (with arguably more optimized versions of combos): (NicoVideo)
Note: Optional parts of a combo will be surrounded by parentheses, for example: (5C(3)). Numbers with parentheses around them simply indicate the number of times that move hits.
Normal Combos
Note: Any of the previous three air BnB portions of the combos can be used instead of the standard j.BC > dj.BC > AT for some other combos, although they may not always work. You are free to use the air BnB of your choice on combos with > (Air BnB) at the end.
Counter Hit & j.[C] Combos
Corner Combos
Move Descriptions
Frame Data Help | |
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Header | Tooltip |
Move Box Colors |
Light gray = Collision Box (A move lacking one means it can go through the opponent's own collision box). |
Damage | Base damage done by this attack.
(X) denotes combined and scaled damage tested against standing V. Sion. |
Red Damage | Damage done to the recoverable red health bar by this attack. The values are inherently scaled and tested against standing V. Sion.
(X) denotes combined damage. |
Proration | The correction value set by this attack and the way it modifies the scaling during a string. See this page for more details.
X% (O) means X% Overrides the previous correction value in a combo if X is of a lower percentage. |
Circuit | Meter gained by this attack on hit.
(X%) denotes combined meter gain. |
Cancel | Actions this move can be cancelled into.
SE = Self cancelable. |
Guard | The way this move must be blocked.
L = Can block crouching |
Startup | Amount of frames that must pass prior to reaching the active frames. Also referred to as "True Startup". |
Active | The amount of frames that this move will have a hitbox. (x) denotes frame gaps where there are no hitboxes is present. Due to varied blockstuns, (x) frames are difficult to use to determine punish windows. Generally the larger the numbers, the more time you have to punish. |
Recovery | Frames that this move has after the active frames if not canceled. The character goes into one frame where they can block but not act afterwards, which is not counted here. |
Advantage | The difference in frames where you can act before your opponent when this move is blocked (assuming the move isn't canceled and the first active frame is blocked). If the opponent uses a move with startup that is at least 2 frames less than this move's negative advantage, it will result in the opponent hitting that move. |
Invul | Lists any defensive properties this move has.
X y~z denotes X property happening between the y to z frames of the animations. If no frames are noted, it means the invincibility lasts through the entire move. Invicibility:
Hurtbox-Based Properties:
Miscellaneous Properties
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Normal Moves
Standing Normals
5A
5B
5C
5C
5[C] |
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Crouching Normals
2A
2B
2C
Jumping Normals
j.A
j.B
j.C
Command Normals
6C
Universal Mechanics
Ground Throw
Ground Throw
6/4A+D |
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Air Throw
Air Throw
j.6/4A+D |
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Shield Bunker
Shield Bunker
214D in neutral or blockstun |
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Heat
Heat
A+B+C |
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Circuit Spark
Circuit Spark
A+B+C during hitstun/blockstun at MAX |
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Special Moves
236X
No laser sprites, framedisplay is bugged. No laser sprites, framedisplay is bugged. EX EX
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623X
214X
22X
Anti-Neco Field
22A/B/C |
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Arc Drive
L.S.O (Superhuman Sister Alliance)
41236C during Max/Heat |
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Another Arc Drive
L.S.O (Superhuman Sister Alliance)
41236C during Blood Heat |
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Last Arc
Saturday Night Forever
Aerial EX Shield during Blood Heat |
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